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 Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010


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Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010  (Read 203 times) More Search
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
profilFletch_smf
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« on: July 28, 2010, 09:31:17 PM »
In the spirit of Cross Promotion, here's a hand from the next Forum Team Thingy Video which will be posted shortly. Will post the next action in a Part A post.

<a href="http://www.pokerhandreplays.com/flash/replayer.swf?pokerhandid=2164964" target="_blank">http://www.pokerhandreplays.com/flash/replayer.swf?pokerhandid=2164964</a>
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2010, 09:44:02 PM »
i think id 3 bet to see where i was at..  if he re pops  im laying it down..  did it tonight a few times..  sucks  but has to be done sometimes
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
profilFletch_smf
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« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2010, 10:28:12 PM »
Quote from: chato15 on July 28, 2010, 09:44:02 PM
i think id 3 bet to see where i was at.. 
Say wat?
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2010, 04:19:38 AM »
Yeah, pretty sure you have to have a bet to 3bet. 

I do like the flop bet here.  The range villain calls you with PF has a lot of aces, but if you're ever going to fold out a weaker ace, it's going to require a bet here and likely OTT.  Conversely, by checking, you essentially force yourself to make a nitty fold if villain bets later streets or call off one or 2 bets not knowing whether the ace hit him or not.  If he's got an ace he's married to, you'll know by the turn and can dump confidently rather than play the guessing game if he bets later.  There's really not much to be gained betting this hand for value, but there is some merit in leading as opposed to calling vs. a weaker ace by a player who can fold it, and potentially some savings from c/calling later. 

Keeping in mind, of course, that this is a forum game and therefore I'm giving villains far more credit as players than the norm here.
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2010, 04:30:46 AM »
Quote from: sixandfour on July 30, 2010, 04:19:38 AM
If he's got an ace he's married to, you'll know by the turn and can dump confidently rather than play the guessing game if he bets later.
Can you expand on this more, please. What is the action that lets me know by the turn if he's got an ace he's married to?
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2010, 05:22:03 AM »
Well, the easy answer is that if he has one he likes too much to release, he reraises and you can drop immediately instead of calling the turn and river bets he makes once you've checked the flop.  Alternatively, if it's a weak ace, the flop bet plus a second barrel OTT will get most solid players to fold a weaker ace when you've raised PF.  Failing all that, you shut down after the turn bet, which is no worse than calling v-bets OTT and OTR if he hit a weak ace and you're not sure whether he has the ace or is betting some other pair or draw.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2010, 05:24:48 AM by sixandfour » Logged

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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2010, 06:22:28 AM »
The problem with this play is that you're C Betting hoping for a raise or a fold. This means you want to win the least or lose the most. I also believe a lot of players play this way, and personally if I whiff the flop, I might certainly check raise it with air, to get the better hands to fold. Checking behind keeps worse hands in play, eliminates the chance for them to bluff you off, and stops you from bloating the pot when you're beaten.

Firing 2 barrels is value towning yourself when they do have an Ace. I've got 30BB at the start of the hand, so getting it in when I shouldn't be is a serious danger.

And finally, if I feign weakness, I can get him to bluff at it with a weaker hand. Like you say, these are good players, so they're certainly capable of making moves if they think they can get me to fold.
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2010, 10:49:03 AM »
Quote from: Fletch_smf on July 30, 2010, 06:22:28 AM
The problem with this play is that you're C Betting hoping for a raise or a fold. This means you want to win the least or lose the most.

Not at all.  I have KK and there's an ace on board.  Realistically, I'm not getting a big pot here, unless I'm losing one.  All I am doing with this line is giving myself a chance to fold out a better hand at the same price as I'd pay to see it as played.
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2010, 12:14:37 AM »
Quote from: sixandfour on July 30, 2010, 10:49:03 AM
I have KK and there's an ace on board.  Realistically, I'm not getting a big pot here, unless I'm losing one.
I agree. So why not check behind?
Quote from: sixandfour
All I am doing with this line is giving myself a chance to fold out a better hand at the same price as I'd pay to see it as played.
I don't believe any Ace that is going to call a raise from the Blinds is ever folding. I guess A rag suited is, but that's a very small part of his range. And betting denies his air or Tx/8x hands a chance to bluff at it on the turn.

EDIT: So in short, better is never folding, and we're not getting 3 streets of value from worse. Checking behind on the flop will get more action from hands we dominate on the later two streets, imo.

Other peoples thoughts?
« Last Edit: August 01, 2010, 08:30:21 PM by Fletch_smf » Logged
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Author Topic: Question of the Week 8 - 28th July, 2010(Read 203 times)
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« Reply #9 on: August 06, 2010, 11:17:43 AM »
My guess would be if he had a playable ace he might of made a bet on the flop
 to see where his ace was maybe halfpot bet and if he re-raises maybe u can fold....I have trouble with these types of hands
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