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Topic: Card Counting and Ranging Bets in Blackjack  (Read 233 times) More Search
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Author Topic: Card Counting and Ranging Bets in Blackjack(Read 233 times)
profilsixandfour
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« on: May 19, 2010, 04:35:01 AM »

This is basically stolen from Wiki, as it easily describes what i use.  I'll explain the scoring system I use at the end.  

Quote from: wikipedia
Basic card counting assigns a positive, negative, or zero value to each card value available. When a card of that value is dealt, the count is adjusted by that card's counting value. Low cards increase the count as they increase the percentage of high cards in the remaining shoe, while high cards decrease it for the opposite reason. For instance, the Hi-Lo system subtracts one for each dealt ten and Ace, and adds one for any value 2-6. Values 7-9 do not affect the count.

The High-Low system is considered a single-level or level-one count, because the count never increases or decreases by more than a single, predetermined value. A multilevel count, such as Zen Count or Wong Halves, makes finer distinctions between card values to gain greater play accuracy. Rather than all cards having a value of +1, 0, or −1, an advanced count might also include card ranks that are counted as +2 and −2, or +.5. Advanced players might additionally maintain a side count (separate count) of specific cards, such as a side count aces, to deal with situations where the best count for betting accuracy differs from the best count for playing accuracy.

Many side count techniques exist including special-purpose counts used when attacking games with nonstandard profitable-play options such as an over/under side bet.[4]

The disadvantage of higher-level counts is that keeping track of more information can detract from the ability to play quickly and accurately. A card-counter might earn more money by playing a simple count quickly?more hands per hour played?than by playing a complex count slowly.

The following table illustrates various ranking systems for card counting.[5]

Card Strategy    2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  J  Q  K  A
Wizard Ace/Five  0  0  0 +1  0  0  0  0   0  0  0  0 −1
KO              +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1  0  0  −1 −1 −1 −1 −1
Hi-Lo           +1 +1 +1 +1 +1  0  0  0  −1 −1 −1 −1 −1
Hi-Opt I         0 +1 +1 +1 +1  0  0  0  −1 −1 −1 −1  0
Hi-Opt II       +1 +1 +2 +2 +1 +1  0  0  −2 −2 −2 −2  0
Zen Count       +1 +1 +2 +2 +2 +1  0  0  −2 −2 −2 −2 −1
Omega II        +1 +1 +2 +2 +2 +1  0  −1 −2 −2 −2 −2  0

Now I pretty much do exactly as stated as far as tracking, except that the scoring I use is not listed here.  It goes as follows:
2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10  J  Q  K  A
0 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1  0  0  −1 −1 −1 −1 -1 (3-8 is +1, ace/face/ten is -1)

Now how do you use this running count?  Basically, as the differential becomes more positive, your bets should go up.  This chart shows how much (don't worry, I'll make sense of it afterward):



The true count essentially means how many cards in the shoe are not accounted for.  The farther in the deck you've gone with a count, the fewer are left, and therefore the higher the likelihood that you'll recieve optimal (-1) cards.  to simplify this, you can basically go on flat system of betting a particular straight betting line.  I generally will place a minimum bet or none (if practical, don't forget they're looking for you counters) on negative counts, and bet more on positive counts in a standard escalation.  for instance, on a +1 I'll bet $10, +2/$20, +3/$30, etc. up to where the line flattens out.  if there are a lot of cards in the shoe yet, I'll cap at triple bets (30), and if we're down to the end, I'll cap as high as $60 on +6 and above.  You kind of get the feel of it as you watch shoes go down in cards.

One other note... This is tricky, because as I said, you have to take care that the staff doesn't wisen up on what you're doing, but whenever possible, you should be wonging.  Wonging is basically watching the table without playing to get a count going, and entering play when the count is going in your favor (the higher the better, obviously.  If there's a way you can pull this without being obvious, do it.  One trick I use is to look for a player I know at the table and approach as if to exchange pleasantries with him, and covertly keep an eye on the table as we chat.  Then, if things run the right way, I'll jump in "spontaneously" and continue catching up with my acquaintance, and if they run south, I go on my merry way.  Again, use caution; don't keep going back to the well throughout the course of the day, or you'll likely end up out of the building.  I've been tossed for suspicion of card counting; all they need is suspicion.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2010, 04:37:54 AM by sixandfour » Logged


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Author Topic: Card Counting and Ranging Bets in Blackjack(Read 233 times)
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Ronin1085
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2010, 01:59:54 PM »

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWgiQ9YNqug" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWgiQ9YNqug</a>

I actually have this DVD -- I should dust it off and peruse it again.
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Author Topic: Card Counting and Ranging Bets in Blackjack(Read 233 times)
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2010, 04:33:44 PM »

I think I read on wiki before that counting cards only give you a 1% edge vs the casino, while using basic blackjack strategy lowers the casino edge to 1%. Not a big difference imo.
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Author Topic: Card Counting and Ranging Bets in Blackjack(Read 233 times)
profilsixandfour
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« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2010, 11:16:12 PM »

I think I read on wiki before that counting cards only give you a 1% edge vs the casino, while using basic blackjack strategy lowers the casino edge to 1%. Not a big difference imo.

I believe that's pretty close to right, maybe even a little on the high side.  It's something you have to do in great volume to make any real money at, and it's hard to do that without tipping the staff off on what you're doing.  That's why you very rarely see people trying to make it a functional income, and the rare ones that do usually eventually get bounced from the casinos.  But for a diversion at Vegas, it's better to have fun with a little advantage than a little disadvantage.  It's never been more than an interesting challenge and diversion for me, learning the tricks and seeing how well I can apply them. 
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Author Topic: Card Counting and Ranging Bets in Blackjack(Read 233 times)
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Ronin1085
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2010, 06:57:36 AM »

I think I read on wiki before that counting cards only give you a 1% edge vs the casino, while using basic blackjack strategy lowers the casino edge to 1%. Not a big difference imo.

I believe that's pretty close to right, maybe even a little on the high side.  It's something you have to do in great volume to make any real money at, and it's hard to do that without tipping the staff off on what you're doing.  That's why you very rarely see people trying to make it a functional income, and the rare ones that do usually eventually get bounced from the casinos.  But for a diversion at Vegas, it's better to have fun with a little advantage than a little disadvantage.  It's never been more than an interesting challenge and diversion for me, learning the tricks and seeing how well I can apply them. 

That's basically how I treat it since I can't stand slot machines and video poker. Plus, you usaully are going to get some comp points.

But doesn't hurt to try to get better.
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